VGC Stream Feedback Thread

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by bianca222, Feb 20, 2017.

  1. bianca222

    bianca222 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2017
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    5
    Figured a centralized feedback thread would be better than random tweets throughout Twitter. Please post your feedback on streams here to help producers improve over time.

    Event:

    The Good:

    The Bad:

    How can the producers improve?

    How was the commentary?

    How was the production value?

    Any other comments:
     
    LightCore and Pyreon like this.
  2. SleepingGiant

    SleepingGiant New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2017
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Event:
    Anaheim Regionals

    The Good:

    • Good commentators and commentating (for the most part)
    • When internet was behaving, stream quality was fine (minus the overlay that revealed HP values)
    • Transparency: the nuggetbridge user was active enough to answer questions and provide updates in a timely manner. The commentators also acknowledged the chat a number of times. This is the main thing you guys have over the official streams, so keep it up.
    The Bad:
    • Not knowing how long the break will be (I understand the nature of this format does lead to long breaks though)
    • Commentator audio was quiet (I had noise-canceling headphones at max volume and it was hard to hear -- others in chat talked about this as well)
    • I understand that internet issues can be out of organizers' controls but I think it's still worth mentioning. Maybe this could be a big downvote to the venue as I'm sure Pokemon isn't the only type of event happening there that enjoys internet.
    How can the producers improve?
    • Change the overlay to not reveal players' HP values.
    • Have some kind of estimate on when the break will be over (I understand schedules sometimes don't work out too well but a guess is better than nothing)
    • Sound check be cool
    • One suggestion that was thrown around in chat was having shiny hunting during the breaks. This could be cool (even if not actual shiny hunting, but something besides a blank screen might be interesting) since it likely doesn't have much planning overhead compared to the sanctioned streams with the interviews and music
    How was the commentary?
    For the most part this was fine. However, I felt that it was less "professional" in certain moments (calling a player's team "one-dimensional" for example) when they said things that were a bit careless. Main feedback I would say is to try not to make fun of the players' choices.

    How was the production value?

    Provided it was a volunteer effort, not an official one, the production value was definitely satisfactory. I feel like most of the complaints I saw from others in chat were not worth addressing.

    Any other comments
    That's all I have to say about that.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2017
  3. Zachary Miller

    Zachary Miller New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2017
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    Just don't bring back krell
     
  4. cubonehaverCDXX

    cubonehaverCDXX New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2017
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    3
    Commentators, I implore you to please pay more attention to the current terrain, and especially its (lack of) interaction with flying pokemon. Too many times i hear stuff like "[player] can't fake out [flying pokemon] in psychic terrain" or "[player] really wants to get a freeze on [grounded pokemon]". Mistakes do happen, but they're happening a bit too often.
    Also feel free to not fill every moment of silence with filler nonsense. Slightly more analytical commentary would be better for both veterans and newcomers than hearing "drags its opponent to the core of the earth" for the 50th time.
     
  5. anti spiral

    anti spiral Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    Messages:
    45
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    UK
    Event: Anaheim Regionals

    The Good:

    I've watched a fair amount of streams this year and this felt like the best. Games were regular, little to no outages and the gaps between games/interviews/games was shorter than others.

    Good chemistry between the presenters/commentators helped the stream during the breaks.

    Twitch chat was well moderated and fun to be in (even if I did get myself timed out (it was deserved)).

    The Bad:

    Sound was really quiet. I had my sound on full and still had to fully concentrate to hear properly. Sound has been like this on the last few streams so I don't know how much can be changed.

    Communication. On Saturday the live stream went up hours before games started, nobody seemed to know when the first game would be streamed. I understand you guys won't always know, but it would be nice to get an update (with an estimate time scale). Same between games.

    How can the producers improve?

    Something on screen when games not in play. Even something as basic as a live video of the venue showing the setup.

    Showing a stream of the players in action when live, but this is obviously more costly and more difficult to implement.

    How was the commentary?

    Good. Knowledgeable commentators helps the viewers and that's what we got. Some times they got a little over excited and flustered, but that's understandable. I appreciate the commentary as I know how difficult it can be to commentate on live events.

    How was the production value?

    Fine. It was not as good as the official streams, but was as good as I've seen from any other volunteer set up. Felt professional.

    Any other comments:

    Keep doing what you're doing. :) It's great to be able to watch more VGC.
     
  6. Giddy

    Giddy New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    3
    Event:
    Anaheim Regional

    The Good:
    - Best commentating of any regional so far
    - Day 2 (top cut) was run really well

    The Bad:
    - Day 1 was a mess and the first 5 sets were unwatchable due to frame lag
    - Huge delay between games, especially on Day 1 with no kind of filler or way to know when the next game would be on so you'd often miss the start
    - No way for players with digital copies to play on stream - meant we hardly saw some of the best players and never saw Gio :'(

    How can the producers improve?
    - Maybe test stream before it goes live to filter out as many bugs and problems as possible so we don't miss the first few sets
    - Is there a way to stream games even if they don't have cartridges? A rental DS that's set up to stream or something? (I don't know how it works)
    - Have SOMETHING happening between games, even if it's just a timer to let us know when the next game will be, music would be nice haha. Could even go as fancy as having analysts between the breaks talking about who's at the event, interesting techs used, recapping what we've seen so far etc.

    How was the commentary?
    - Best so far, I think the commentators are starting to learn the format a bit now

    How was the production value?
    - Day 2 wasn't too bad although the picture quality was still pretty blurry, the headers and transitions to the casters was nice though.

    Any other comments:
    - So far I've always skipped watching the first day of a regional because the stream quality is always virtually unwatchable for most of the day, I think the only exception to this was London and maybe San Jose. It's always fixed for Day 2 though so it would be nice if they could sort the issues before hand so I don't have to miss "Aaron Cybertron Zheng here" playing his first games :(

    - Thanks to the staff and commentators who are volunteering to put these events on!
     
  7. Temple

    Temple Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    11
    If both players are using digital carts, as the case with Aaron Zheng vs Gavin Michaels on Day 1 Swiss and Gavin Michaels vs Kamran Jahadi in Top 4, the only way to watch them would be to transfer their Pokémon onto a physical cart, but if both players are using Return/Fustration, then its a bad idea as the power of those moves would be reduced to 70 and that's not a smart move for the stream and the players in general
     
  8. bianca222

    bianca222 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2017
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    5
    Including a note from me in regards to Anaheim
     
  9. liquidmonk

    liquidmonk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2017
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    67
    I was sort of following the stream live and have since revisited a lot of VODs. For reference, I used to be a professional commentator for Hearthstone and have done events for Blizzard, Twitch, Dreamhack, ESL, etc... I've also worked a lot behind the scenes directing casters.

    Adam and Gabby have a lot of chemistry and you can clearly tell they've practice and have improved so much from Florida. Adam does a great job at breaking down analysis in a way that the average non-hardcore viewer can understand. Gabby focuses more on play-by-play but doesn't over-narrate the game, so she does it better than almost anyone I've seen. This is a really underrated talent, especially when trying to appeal to a casual audience. She does a good job at weaving in small pieces of analysis as well.

    Commentary feedback:
    • I wasn't a fan of Duy's use of "Punch punch punch punch punch" when describing all-out-pummeling nor "munch munch munch" when describing eating a berry. These comments seemed to stick out in an awkward way and brought me out of the immersion of the game.
    • I don't think the pair of Duy and Gabby works. I see them both as primarily play-by-play commentators and when they were paired together, they seemed to fumble around with overly-narrating the game instead of analysis.
    In terms of production, framing the shot was the biggest problem I saw. Some examples include:
    • When the stream started, the shot was way too high and was really unflattering to Duy, making him seem much shorter than he probably is.
    • Even afterwards, I felt the shot was still high since you couldn't see the casters' hands or the table. Between games, it's important to use your entire body to cast instead of just your voice. I think that's something all the casters could work on, but Adam seems to have the best grasp of this. Watching the VODs to see where your hands are at all times is helpful.
    • Casters were often off-center. We usually use markers such as gaffers tape so that casters can always center themselves.
    • If someone like Jen is running a lot of events, it might be nice to invest in a step and repeat for the background that you can lug around. It adds a lot of professionalism and doesn't break the bank, especially if you can get TPCi to pay for it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2017
    Mindape and PsyJ like this.
  10. kibago11

    kibago11 New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2017
    Messages:
    8
    Likes Received:
    0
    Event: Geico Invitational

    The Good:
    Excellent competitors and match performances
    Fast turnaround between GG and next match
    Clean and easy stream overlays
    Dedication of players and casting team

    The Bad:
    Mixed production equipment between hosts caused audio issues
    General WiFi issues (but that's the same with any online tournament)
    Slide transition and information sometimes has errors

    How can the producers improve?
    For the first event of it's kind it was a great start, really easy viewing. As mentioned above, there were a few errors in selection of video inputs, player information and results, and where elements of the overlays would block or cut-off pertinent information. The team were quick to rectify, but something to hone for future. Also, given more time, I'd like to think the casters could obtain (through ONOG/Geico or otherwise) better audio equipment to stream with, as there were some niggly issues with it that took you out of the experience.

    How was the commentary?
    Justin @AzazeLTheGod - valiantly fought through stomach issues, so well done to him. Needed a while to warm up, as his energy levels were a little too low for the first few games (possibly due to illness?). Pairing with Wolfe rectified this a little, but he also needs to work on smiling and remaining in the zone for when he's on camera and not talking. He also struggled to keep over-analysis in check, which forced Markus to often have to cut him off and force a play-by-play interaction. Still, very insightful, glad to see him back in action once again.

    Markus @13Yoshi37 - Does this guy sleep? Joking aside, always cognitive and aware of timing and structure to professional commentary, even considering timezone factors. Analysis is always strong, and can pivot well when the other commentator needs him to. Also, think having practiced a lot last year really helped, he calmed down Wolfe a fair bit when he might have burst all over the place, and gave professionalism to the parts outside of the games. Hard to really critique much, you could see how much doing this meant to him.

    Wolfe @Wolfey - His thought process is always astounding. Sees things as they are happening and can pass that thought train on to a dedicated play-by-play caster well. Really enjoy his insights and the energy that he can pass with it to the other caster (ie. Justin). However, Wolfe still suffers from usual Wolfe problems - sometimes too much energy and pace to his speech make him seem a little all over the place. Pairing with Markus helped this out a bit, but still good to note. Also, I'm sure he knows not many people enjoyed the mispronounciations by now, but will add anyway. Currently seems like one of the least 'professional' of the group in mannerisms, but that could come with practice - still a great start!

    Dan @aDrive_tk - Was really impressed by his energy and unflinching style to commentary - he could talk over the whole game on his own and direct the right level of enthusiasm and excitement needed. His lack of experience in professional commentary and VGC showed often (picking up the kill, asking what year Shoma was champ, etc.). but as this was literally his first time doing this I don't think it's too damning a critique. Above all else, you can see how much it meant to him, and the amount of practice put in. Keep it up.

    Aaron @Cybertron - Always a great pick for good insight, enthusiasm and interaction with other casters. His internet let him down more than anything else. Applied a lot of support to Dan in their matches (obviously so: 'Glad you brought it up', 'totally agree with your analysis) but this would have done a lot for his confidence, so its great to see. Also, doing a finals interview after losing in that fashion is brave, and think that he showed great humility and composure.

    How was the production value?
    As mentioned before, clean and simple overlays were appreciated. Helpful for beginners and veterans alike. Relying on personal caster equipment is always tough, so that's something to consider if this becomes a bigger set of tournaments. Would like to see an overall round timer implemented for future streams, as this could play a factor at points (didn't this weekend).

    Any other comments:
    Great start to something very exciting. Invitationals offer really exciting showcases and are a big way to introduce players, fans and potential fans to some of the best content we can provide, from people who are active and involved in the community. Interested to see a follow up, with more professionalism, but the same level of enthusiasm and heart that this had.

    Tagging: @liquidmonk
     
  11. liquidmonk

    liquidmonk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2017
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    67
    I'm going to make a feedback post, but I'll address all of the above first. I think all your feedback is very on point and I don't really disagree with anything. I just want to add some insight and clarification:

    Most of the production mistakes were due to being unfamiliar with the scene and doing Pokemon as a game for the first time. The camera freezes issues were due to a faulty capture card on ONOG's end.

    Regarding "Elements of the overlays would block or cut-off pertinent information", this was done on purpose to hide HP bars, but I'd like feedback on whether the community prefers this or not.

    Finally, we never announced this, but there is one VGC 2017 rule we changed for the event. We scrapped the match round timer rule altogether because we didn't want to get into a situation where we would have to employ it. Also, we would have had to change it altogether anyways for the best of 5.
     
  12. Temple

    Temple Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    11
    I feel like in general, the way the HP bars were hidden was done much better than in 2012 at the Worlds Finals linked here. The black bars weren't visually appealing, but since it was 2012 and I assume that the resources weren't as advanced, I understand, but I did enjoy how just the numbers were cut off, but not that actual HP bar. I also like how you guys got rid of the 50 minute round timer. It makes it easier for players to simply focus on the match, not how much time is left and whether or not to drain it.
     
  13. kibago11

    kibago11 New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2017
    Messages:
    8
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks for taking the time to respond, appreciate it! Completely understand that mistakes happen and that this was the first foray into the scene. Just wanted to put them out there so it's a quality point moving forward.

    I actually wasn't referring to HP bars when mentioning the overlays, just that some of your transitions left a lower third graphic up that cut off on screen features, ie. teams or webcam feeds. Again, very small, but something to consider in the next build. IMO, hiding HP numbers is fine, and something that streamed players appreciate. Glad you could encorporate it!

    And completely understood regarding timer. It's a sticky situation to find yourself in, and doesn't help the viewer exeperience.

    As said before, really interesting start, lots of positive takeaways here!
     
  14. bigguy

    bigguy New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2017
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    Event: GEICO Invitational

    The Good:

    -The Matches: Wow, day one had some of the best matches I've seen streamed so far. I understand that this is hard to replicate, but I guess it implies that the participants selected were excellent fits. You had a wide variety of teams and strategies, so it made for interesting matchups than it would have been if everyone brought extremely similar teams.

    -The Format: While I'm sure some will recommend small tweaks to the actual tournament structure, I thought separating it into 2 pools before making a top 4 cut worked well and allowed for a pretty solid variety of matchups.

    -Graphics/layout: For the most part the graphics were clean, professional, and helpful in terms of information. I liked having each players' team prepared visually on the website and on the bottom of the stream. (Since we're spectating we can't click around on the DS to view the opponent's team if we forget some of their 6) I might have liked a better graphic displaying the Final 4 matchups, something with more of a flow chart feel, but overall it looked good. I also liked having the players on camera. I know some of the regionals and such have stopped doing this (privacy reasons perhaps?) but it's a small thing that goes a long way to make the stream more interesting. Even if the player isn't particularly animated, it's easier to get to "know" someone when you see them play. Seeing them creates more of a connection, making you feel more compelled to root for them, in my opinion anyways. I might also include the articles posted on Trainer Tower as a positive aspect of the "layout" of the tournament.

    -Commentary: Will elaborate below, but it was definitely a strong positive. Pokemon's not a particularly compelling game visually, so spectating really relies on strong commentary. I felt this event had it.

    The Bad:

    -Slow pacing (mostly day 1): I'm not sure if everyone concurs with this opinion, but I believe that anything we can do to streamline the tournaments and make them go faster is a plus. Day one ended up being something like 7.5-8 hours long... which is a long time to sit down and watch something. I know some of it involved technical difficulties and it's the first time trying something like this, but the less downtime the better. The commentators did a good job filling time in between matches, but in the end it's still just filler. If it's a tournament, such as this, where we get to see every single match then we have to keep things moving. I was feeling like it was running kind of late into the evening and I live in the Central US; I can't imagine many Europeans hanging around. (I know the timing was set primarily with US in mind due to sponsors, but it ran a little late even for us)

    -Best of 5: This kind of goes hand-in-hand with the point above, but I just preferred Bo3 to Bo5. Maybe it's because I'm so used to watching Bo3, but 5 felt a little drawn out, though it didn't help that each match ended up being a shutout the 2nd day. I also like the idea that the element of surprise carries more weight in Bo3, since 5 gives you longer to exhaust all your opponents' tricks.

    -Technical Issues: This will always be a problem, so I guess it's just a matter of trying to improve with each successive tournament. The stream going out a few times was no good, particularly during the climax of Markus vs Enosh's first game.

    How can the producers improve?

    Maybe a little bit more preparation with regards to intros, segues, and the closing bits. I know at the tail end of the stream Day 2 they seemed a little unsure about how to end things, ending up repeating stuff and kind of "looking" at each other to see who wants to cut it off. Also, it was kind of disappointing for Shoma to not have a camera, so... encourage participants to get a camera/look for those who do have one? :p

    How was the commentary?

    I thought overall this was the best commentary I'd seen on a pokemon stream so far. I guess you could divide the commentators into the "high energy" and the not quite as high energy. Justin was solid as the "play-by-play", although he also displayed good knowledge of the game/competitors. Same with Markus, though he was a bit more on the "color commentary" side. Dan was actually really impressive as a commentator and seemed to have the most "professional announcer" type voice of the group. He didn't know as much about the players/scene as the others, but it's not like he was ignorant and did a good job doing play-by-play while also keeping a high level of energy and enthusiasm.

    Cybertron was great (although I follow his Youtube vids every day, so I've grown accustomed to his style) and seems to do a good job of both in depth commentary as well as making it sound approachable for less experienced viewers. I imagine Wolfe will be the most divisive of the group, but personally he was my favorite one by far. He gets off on tangents and babbles long-winded strategical thoughts, talking way too fast the whole time... but he really brings the enthusiasm. My favorite part of the stream was when he and Cybertron were on there together and Wolfe kind of went off the rails. I feel like if you read a book about what not to do as an announcer, he'd probably be doing lots of the things in there. But holy cow, you can feel his excitement when he gets worked up and it's contagious. Maybe pair him with someone who's slightly lower energy to contain him a little bit? But even so, it's more fun when the commentators really get into it, so I've got Wolfe's back in this 100%.

    I also really liked that the commentators were top players. I imagine the people who usually do the commentary are not exactly scrubs, but you can really hear some of the next level type thinking in some of their commentary. It was easy to see why these are the type of guys who beat the pants off me on battlespot.

    How was the production value?

    Good?

    Any other comments:

    -Just something random that wasn't necessarily good or bad, but kind of amusing: the way the announcers plugged GEICO at various times. My favorite was one match where Dan said something to the effect of "and he does some chip damage to that Porygon... I'd say about 15%. And if you'd like to save 15% or more on car insurance..." I know advertising type stuff tends to make people give a thumbs down, but that line had me laughing.

    -Wolfe said something on the stream about QR Codes for the teams being available online today, but as of yet I don't see them. I think this is a really cool idea, however, as long as the players are willing to share.

    So yeah, maybe that was long-winded, but I thoroughly enjoyed the event and wanted to leave some positive feedback and encouragement. Just diving into VGC as a new player has been really difficult (and unsuccessful, I might add) but I really enjoy seeing the best play and often feel that there's not nearly enough content/streams that display high quality play. The day 1 matches were probably the most compelling I've seen since getting into this, so let's do it again sometime soon, yeah? :D
     
  15. JTK

    JTK Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Event: The Geico Invitational

    The Good:
    • High quality of play - all the matches played were entertaining, high level matches that did a good job of reflecting the current status of the meta game.
    The Bad:
    • Twitch Chat - I personally don't agree with how twitch chat plays alongside of competitions, but that's mostly because I don't like the negativity that can be persisted there. While I know that people like chat, and like being able to show their support for the players on stream, I really wish there was a way to automod out comments like "Why did X do Y?" or "Oh my god, Q is so bad." Or more explicit versions of those things. This is more of a platform problem than with the Geico stream, though.
    • Best of 5 - I don't think it actually made a difference in the outcome of the games. It might be more interesting to do something more aligned with Hearthstone and do Bo5 matches with the possibility of running different squads. With multiple battle boxes in game, it's technically possible to do this now.
    How can the producers improve?

    The layout of the stream needs to be improved, it felt a bit rushed. I didn't like how the trainer names/youtube names ran into the center of the bottom information bar, overlapping with the "Group Whatever Match This Is" portion of the layout. I thought the player cameras could be made a bit smaller in exchange for making the actual teams that the battlers are running larger/more prominent in the layout. I understand wanting to hide the HP number for the bottom player, however I didn't like how the text box was sacrificed for that benefit for the players. If somebody was watching the stream who was hard of hearing (or otherwise unable to listen to the sound), they wouldn't be able to know some of the items when they activate, or what moves were used into protects for example.

    Skipping team preview in favor of showing the commentator cameras was also an interesting choice. I understand not wanting to show the Festival Plaza/team selection screens however I think showing how players handle the actual team preview screen provides some useful information for the audience - for example, if a player selects their four Pokemon quickly that's an indication of confidence going into the game, which can help with telling the story of a match.

    Along the lines of the Pokemon icons, it would've been great if they could've been modified based off of if they were brought to a game or not - for example, highlighted if it's been displayed in a game, or low lighted if it's knocked out. This is something that grassroot streams need to improve on too.

    It might be worthwhile to ask commentators to invest in the same microphone/webcams so that their setups are as identical as possible. The sound balance was good but the quality difference between Markus and Justin was fairly noticeable. I understand that players can't really be expected to invest in a nice microphone for a tournament but even if the commentators could borrow similar-ish setups, I think it would make a huge difference in the overall quality.

    How was the commentary?


    Slow down! There's a lot to be said and it's tempting to talk faster as a way to fit everything in. Instead, slowing down and prioritizing what information you're imparting to the viewers I think is the better approach - while it's great to dive deep and get to the more technical points of play you have to balance it out with basic information so viewers with no past knowledge can still follow along.

    Don't step on each others toes as much, I'm all for interrupting when there's hype but practice listening to each others speech patterns so that the handoffs sound natural. This takes a while to develop though, for the first time these pairs were working together I thought that all the commentators did a good job.

    Shoutouts to Justin commentating through a stomach virus - I couldn't tell that your sick, which is a great indication of your professionalism throughout the event.

    Any other comments:

    I apologize for the fact that most of this criticism is aimed at ONOG rather than the commentators/players involved with the tournament; the impression I got from the stream was that the best was made of what resources were available at the time the tournament started and most future improvements will be on the organizational side of things. That being said, I wish the best of luck to ONOG in their future Pokemon endeavors!
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2017
    PsyJ likes this.
  16. Damo

    Damo Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    11
    Event: Regionals of the first March-weekend

    The Good:

    - I really liked the commentator-choices on the american stream. They did an amazing job in providing background-informations/stories (he he) and fluent speaking. I'll probably have three kids if I'd have to praise every commentators performance but all in all they did an outstanding job in entertaining and doing informative stuff.
    - There were no technical issues. I had to watch the VoD of both regionals and as far as I can tell, there were not many technical problems or anything. Really smooth performance on this side too.

    The Bad:

    - Even though the layout looks professional and clean, there was unnecessary blank space on the left and the right side of the battlescreen. This is really something that can be improved because I don't always watch every battle from the start so it would be amazing if I could see the teams of both players and start thinking "with them" on how the battle could go.

    [​IMG]

    - The language-quality between both streams. I know Europe doesn't have a full native crew but the quality on stream is kinda lacking if Jay/Lee, Lee/Matt or Matt/Jay are not on screen. This is not an attack in any way towards our non-english-speaking commentators but I noticed a slight difference in quality when watching a non-mentioned duo on screen which leads to many filler-phrases that makes me want to tune in later again. I will or I did provide feedback already to almost everyone of the crew so I hope to see this as an chance to improve.

    - The shout-moments. When watching Gigalith getting paralyzed three times in a row there were some "WHOAA" "WHAA"-moments which made me shudder a little - no offense though. I just think not eeevery one of them was "necessary" :p Still good job Evan and Aaron <3

    Any other comments: It is getting better with every stream, which is a highlight.
     
  17. EleGiggle

    EleGiggle Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2017
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    5
    Turn off sub mode, no one ever sub anyways. Alot of people are closing the stream because twitch chat is dead
     
  18. DrFidget

    DrFidget Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2017
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    45
    I have some thoughts on the current commentary structure and I’m just going to list a few of them.

    Pokémon is a turn based game, it’s being commentated like it’s real time. Unlike sports, other esports, or even card games, you don’t actually see the action as it happens. Animations play out seconds if not minutes after the plays were made. The actual “action” all happens at move select and the animations just inform the board position for the next turn. It’s not ideal for spectating and does put commentary in a weird spot. As it stands right now, the “color” commentator usually breaks down how the board has changed, which is the actual play by play, and the play by play commentator is little more than a reader of game text.

    The inexplicable need to read everything already written on screen out loud is not additive to the viewing experience. I’ve been told it’s because “some viewers tab out”, but people who don’t care enough to watch should not be given priority. I recently got a new perspective on all this since my mom started watching streams. She’s finished Diamond and Moon but not played competitively, that should fall somewhere in the target audience. She’s mostly lost in the current commentary pattern of: Here’s what might happen next, here is text of what happened, repeat. It is much easier to follow when someone is explaining why something is happening during the animations, instead of just echoing the text.

    Another thing I’ve mentioned before is the use of “we see”, “we do see”, “will we see?” etc. Giving the players credit for their own plays is much more engaging to the audience than giving yourself credit for seeing it. For example in a game with a lot of mirrors saying “we see Bronzong try go for a skill swap on Kyogre” removes the players from the game entirely. “We” are not playing the game, Bronzong is not a sentient being capable of making it’s own decisions, and there may be two Bronzong or Kyogre on the field and you didn’t specify either. Calling out the player more helps people follow along, and gives people someone to root for. Constantly giving credit and agency to pokémon instead detracts from what actually happened. The action not happening in real time obscures players from their plays enough already. Commentary should aim to connect the two, not divide it further. (I saw the finals of ONOG and they did a wonderful job of this.)
     
    YureeVGC and blubobebabi like this.
  19. Pyritie

    Pyritie Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    11
    Location:
    UK
    I feel like Duy sounded half-asleep the whole time I watched (late day 1 and all of day 2). Did he get enough sleep?
     

Share This Page