VGC17 Roles Compendium

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Pyritie, Feb 2, 2017.

  1. Pyritie

    Pyritie Member

    Jan 27, 2017
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    [​IMG] Arcanine - One of the best intimidators in the format. Arcanine has good bulk, a good defensive typing, access to recovery in Morning Sun, and learns a load of useful support moves like Snarl and Will-O-Wisp. Usually seen with an item like Sitrus Berry.

    [​IMG] Gyarados - A more offensive intimidator with power and a useful typing. Frequently used with Waterfall and a Waterium-Z for a strong hit, but it can also learn moves like Taunt and Roar. Can also provide a win condition with Dragon Dance, but has to watch out for all the electric attacks that are thrown around.

    [​IMG] Salamence - A strong and very offensive special-attacking pokemon, usually seen with Draco Meteor, Flamethrower or Fire Blast, and other moves like Hydro Pump, Substitute, or Protect. Likes having an item such as Draconium-Z to turn its Draco Meteor into an incredibly powerful attack, but is otherwise fairly flexible.

    [​IMG] Krookodile - Another offensively oriented intimidator but with a ground type. Krookodile is not as fast or powerful as other ground types such as Garchomp, but intimidate alone makes it a strong choice for a team, and it also has access to taunt.

    [​IMG] Granbull - While it has a high Attack stat and a good movepool, the rest of its stats are lackluster, especially its speed. If you need a slow intimidator for trick room, Granbull might be useful to you, but don't expect it to stick around for long, especially since many teams are carrying steel or poison attacks for the tapus.

    [​IMG] Masquerain - Has access to Quiver Dance and a fairly large movepool including a few water and ice moves, but is still incredibly frail.

    [​IMG] Stoutland - Use Sand Rush instead.

    Follow Me

    [​IMG] Clefairy - Has a solid support movepool to go along with its access to Follow Me, and also has the coveted Friend Guard, which lets it provide support to a partner just by being on the field. Clefairy is also incredibly passive, however, and is not a threat to teams with strong spread moves.

    [​IMG] Clefable - Very similar to Clefairy, but with a few key differences. It can't use Eviolite, making it unable to take a single strong attack as well as Clefairy can, but can hold an item like Sitrus Berry to make it stick around longer. It also has a stronger special attack stat to make use of its massive movepool. Lastly, Magic Guard is a useful ability to take advantage of all the Toxic being thrown around.

    [​IMG] Lucario - Unlike the other two pokemon available with Follow Me, Lucario is much more offensive. It's also a lot more frail, so don't expect it to be able to sit on the field for a long time soaking up hits like Clefairy and Clefable can. It also gets access to Inner Focus, letting it smack Porygon2 hard with a Close Combat even under the threat of a Fake Out.

    Rage Powder

    [​IMG] Butterfree - Incredibly frail but has access to a few cool support moves like Sleep Powder (with Compound Eyes to make it more accurate!) and Tailwind.

    [​IMG] Parasect - Has Dry Skin to give it an immunity to water moves, but the pokemon seen on rain teams frequently carry an ice or flying move to hit it hard anyway. Parasect is also very slow, but it does have access to the coveted Spore, letting it mess with opposing trick room teams. It can also learn Wide Guard.

    [​IMG] Ariados - Also frail, but has a few useful support moves like Toxic Thread, Sticky Web, Disable, Electroweb (after pokebank), and a variety of poison moves and priority moves.

    Fake Out

    [​IMG] Alolan Raichu - A great partner to both Tapu Koko and Tapu Lele, Raichu takes advantage of the terrain wars this format has seen. On top of being a fairly powerful attacker, it's also very fast, especially in electric terrain. Usually seen with either a focus sash or a z-crystal like psychium z.

    [​IMG] Alolan Persian - A fast and surprisingly bulky support pokemon thanks to Fur Coat. It might seem similar to Liepard from previous formats, but it sticks around for a lot longer and has a great support movepool with moves like Feint, Snarl, Parting Shot, and Foul Play. It can even run an assault vest set.

    [​IMG] Hariyama - A slow, bulky, hard hitter that uses fake out to help its partner set up trick room safely, with access to Guts to abuse the trick room afterwards. It's also one of the few pokemon that learns knock off.

    [​IMG] Weavile - The fastest pokemon with fake out in the format with good offenses to back them up. Unfortunately, it has paper-thin defenses and its STABs aren't as valuable as they were in previous formats.

    [​IMG] Togedemaru - Provides a useful set of resistances and has the unique combination of fake out and lightning rod. It also has access to encore and nuzzle.

    [​IMG] Incineroar - Has a unique typing that gives it a whole bunch of useful resistances. Hits fairly hard and can also provide teams with a slow u-turn. Can also run an assault vest set with Snarl.

    [​IMG] Salazzle - Poison and Fire are both great STABs to have, hitting loads of the meta super effectively, but doesn't hit hard enough without a boosting item and can't survive for very long unless it has a focus sash.

    Other options: Kangaskhan, Sableye, Spinda

    Weather Setters

    [​IMG] Pelipper - An offensive but frail rain setter with a good secondary STAB move in Hurricane. It's also one of the better pokemon with access to tailwind, and can also run wide guard if spread moves are a problem for your team. Usually seen with a focus sash. Pelipper is also frequently paired with golduck for a rain core known as "double duck" even though pelicans aren't ducks.

    [​IMG] Politoed - A more bulky, supportive rain setter. It's not going to be making big dents in your opponent, but its ability to stick around for a while and provide support with encore and perish song can be invaluable. If you're not using a teammate with swift swim, politoed is usually a better pick.

    [​IMG] Torkoal - The only pokemon with drought in the format, torkoal is usually seen abusing the sun with its strong eruptions on a trick room team. It doesn't have a great movepool though and is fairly easy to wear down.

    [​IMG] Gigalith - The only sand stream pokemon in the format. There aren't many good sand rush abusers in the format so gigalith is usually seen using the sand for itself to boost its special defense to absurd levels and slowly chip away at the team. Frequently seen on trick room teams, gigalith hits surprisingly hard, and can either run an offensive set with three attacks or a more supportive one with wide guard.

    [​IMG] Alolan Ninetales - The main reason to use this hail setter is its access to Aurora Veil, setting both light screen and reflect in one turn for your team. It's also pretty fast and frail, and while it loves being able to throw around blizzards and blast certain pokemon with freeze dry, it doesn't hit very hard without a boosting item, as most carry a focus sash. It also has access to a few other support moves like icy wind, encore, and disable. It can also learn fairy-type moves like moonblast and dazzling gleam but it doesn't use them much, as there's not a lot of pokemon in the format that are weak to fairy that aren't also weak to ice.

    [​IMG] Vanilluxe - A slower and harder-hitting hail setter. It doesn't have as many support moves as ninetales does, especially aurora veil, but it does hit significantly harder and has a few niche coverage moves like flash cannon. Is usually seen with a choice scarf.

    Weather Abusers

    [​IMG] Golduck - This format doesn't have any of the good swift swim pokemon that have been available in the past, like ludicolo and kingdra, so golduck is the next best thing. It hits incredibly hard with its rain-boosted hydro pumps, and is frequently seen carrying a waterium Z to get off one big accurate attack. It also has access to scald, soak, ice beam, and encore, which round out its common movesets.

    [​IMG] Lilligant - A useful Chlorophyll supporter with access to Sleep Powder, After You, and Helping hand. Only ever seen with Torkoal as a partner, to let Torkoal get off fast eruptions with After You. If your name is Sun Dude, you can also run lilligant offensively with things like Z-Nature Power.

    [​IMG] Stoutland - Similar to lilligant except with Sand Rush instead, Stoutland helps its teammates get off fast devastating attacks with After You. It also has a surprisingly large movepool, with access to wild charge, play rough, and psychic fangs.

    [​IMG] Lycanroc - Another Sand Rush user and also the fastest thing in the metagame when sand is up. Unfortunately lycanroc suffers from poor stats and a shallow movepool.

    [​IMG] Alolan Sandslash - Hail finally has a weather abuser with slush rush sandslash, but even under a hailstorm it's not as fast as you'd hope. Its attack stat isn't bad but its best attacking moves have a low base power, making it not as devastating as other weather abusers by itself.

    [​IMG] Poliwrath - Another pokemon with swift swim, but its attack stat isn't great, all of its moves are weak, and in general it just isn't good at getting the KOs it needs to get.

    Other options: Leafeon, Lumineon

    Trick Room Setters

    [​IMG] Porygon2 - By far the bulkiest trick room setter in the format, there's very few attacks that can cleanly OHKO it. Porygon2 has access to Recover to stick around for a long time, and has a plethora of special attacks it can learn to patch up any of your team's weaknesses. Download can give it a special attack boost to let it hit harder. Porygon2 is fairly susceptible to taunt and fake out, however, as its item slot is taken by eviolite (so no mental herb) and it rarely carries protect. Toxic is another good way to put it on a timer.

    [​IMG] Oranguru - This pokemon seems designed from the ground up to be made for doubles trick room teams, and it's certainly good at it. Instruct is a great move to let your trick room attackers get off their strong attacks twice in one turn, and it has two great abilities in telepathy and inner focus -- pick whichever suits your team best. Unlike porygon2, oranguru is fairly limited in its offensive capabilities, and doesn't have as much bulk as you'd like -- it's no cresselia, and any strong z-move should OHKO it.

    [​IMG] Mimikyu - Ghost typing gives it a fake out immunity, and disguise forces the opponent to double-target it if they want to get rid of mimikyu in one turn. Ghost and fairy STABs have perfect coverage in this metagame, and it also learns a plethora of support moves like taunt, will-o-wisp, and curse.

    Other options: Alakazam, Slowbro, Slowking, Gengar, Hypno, Exeggutor, Starmie, Porygon Z, Espeon, Misdreavus, Mismagius, Spinda, Kecleon, Whimsicott, Carbink, Trevenant, Comfey, Bruxish, Nihilego


    [​IMG] Pelipper - One of the most solid tailwind users in the format, as it can use the threat of its swift swim partner to set up a tailwind safely. Pelipper can be built both as a sweeper and as a supporter, and tailwind works on both sets. Frequently seen with a focus sash.

    [​IMG] Talonflame - While the gale wings nerf has hit talonflame hard, it can still get off a priority tailwind at full HP and hit things hard with its dual 120 BP STABs. Talonflame also has other cool support moves like will-o-wisp, taunt, and quick guard.

    [​IMG] Aerodactyl - Incredibly fast but frail tailwind user that also has a fast rock slide and wide guard. Frequently seen running sky drop and a focus sash.

    [​IMG] Whimsicott - Has a prankster tailwind along with a wide variety of other support moves. Has to watch out for psychic terrain and dark-types blocking prankster now, though.

    [​IMG] Mandibuzz - By far the bulkiest tailwind setter in the format, mandibuzz can stick around for a long time with roost and support its team with moves like foul play, snarl, taunt, knock off, and whirlwind.

    [​IMG] Braviary - Another offensive tailwind setter that can take advantage of intimidates with Defiant and also has access to moves like Superpower and Rock Slide.

    Other options: Butterfree, Ledian, Murkrow, Honchkrow, Drifblim, Toucannon, Oricorio

    Icy Wind

    [​IMG] Alolan Ninetales - One of the few good users of icy wind in the format, but even still, ninetales usually prefers using other moves like aurora veil, freeze-dry, encore, or blizzard over icy wind.

    [​IMG] Vanilluxe - It's usually carrying a scarf which it prefers using to get off strong blizzards instead of piddly icy wind damage. Still, it's something to watch out for.

    [​IMG] Weavile - It's not going to be doing any damage, but if you need a fast icy wind pokemon that also has access to fake out, weavile might be worth using.

    Other options: Glaceon, Delibird, Spinda, Glalie, Froslass

    Quick Guard

    A general lack of priority moves along with Psychic Terrain means quick guard will rarely, if ever, be a requirement for a team. Nonetheless, here are the available pokemon that can learn it:

    [​IMG] Scizor - Psychic Terrain means Scizor isn't able to throw around strong bullet punches as easily as it could in the past, which is why it usually uses Steelium Z to get a one-use steel move that isn't blocked by priority-guarding effects. Scizor usually has bullet punch, a bug move, swords dance, and protect, but Quick Guard could be used in place of one of those moves.

    [​IMG] Crobat - Not as useful as it was last year due to fake out being used less frequently and losing access to Tailwind. That being said, it's still incredibly fast and its poison attacks can hit all of the fairy types in this metagame hard.

    [​IMG] Talonflame - Much less centralising than it was in previous formats due to the gale wings nerf, but talonflame can still hit hard with its base 120 power STAB moves, high speed, and access to useful support moves like quick guard, taunt, and will-o-wisp.

    [​IMG] Pheromosa - Should be getting support from another pokemon to avoid priority moves, instead of blocking them itself.

    Other options: Machamp, Lucario, Archeops, Pangoro, Lycanroc, Passimian

    Wide Guard

    Parasect, Pelipper, Aerodactyl, Gigalith, Hariyama - See above

    [​IMG] Araquanid - A slow physical attacker that hits incredibly hard with its water-type moves due to its ability, Water Bubble. It usually doesn't need any other moves besides its STABs, so wide guard is usually the best move for the third slot, though it does also have access to z-stockpile.

    [​IMG] Golisopod - Learns a plethora of priority moves and can hit fairly hard, but is held back by its ability, Emergency Exit

    [​IMG] Celesteela - Usually has better things to run than wide guard, like leech seed, flamethrower, or substitute, but it is an option

    [​IMG] Guzzlord - Its HP makes it look bulkier than it actually is, and its movepool and offensive stats are terrible. Don't use this unless you're trying to lose.

    Other options: Machamp, Golem, Probopass, Bastiodon, Carracosta, Alomomola, Crabominable, Bewear, Turtonator

    Lightning Rod

    See above: Togedemaru

    [​IMG] Alolan Marowak - Lightning rod combined with its typing makes marowak a fantastic check to a load of different pokemon. Thick club makes it hit incredibly hard, and Bonemerang lets it hit even more things super-effectively.

    Other options: Seaking

    Storm Drain

    [​IMG] Gastrodon - Abuses storm drain to effectively nullify rain teams and stays alive for a long time due to its bulk and Recover. It can also learn toxic to stall out other bulky pokemon, and z-stockpile to fully heal itself and boost its defenses.

    Other options: Lumineon

    Sleep inducers

    See above: Parasect, Lilligant, Butterfree

    [​IMG] Smeargle - It can't learn Dark Void any more but smeargle can still learn Spore and every single other support move in the game. As the metagame doesn't revolve around a singular threat any more, smeargle's antics are far less centralising than in previous metagames, but it's still a fantastic support pokemon to watch out for.

    [​IMG] Shiinotic - Its access to Spore seems to be the only thing going for it. It isn't nearly as bulky as amoonguss is and doesn't have access to rage powder, nor does it have good offenses to make up for its frailty.

    Other options: Exeggutor
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
    Haru, Gentlefish, notSAFE and 6 others like this.
  2. AurorusiteVGC

    AurorusiteVGC Member

    Jan 27, 2017
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    definitely not finland
    Fake Out is actually released now on Salazzle and is usable on VGC 2017 ladder.
    Pyritie likes this.
  3. GayBird

    GayBird Active Member

    Jan 28, 2017
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    Huntington Beach, CA
    Lycanroc sees a bit of use on showdown as a sand abuser. Sand rush and stuff.
  4. Mystic

    Mystic New Member

    Feb 1, 2017
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    I love this post! I only suggest that you add Choice Scarf to Vanilluxe's blurb. Something like 80% of Vanilluxe on BattleSpot and Showdown are Scarfed, which is important to know.
  5. RevRush

    RevRush Member

    Jan 27, 2017
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    Nice list, seem to hit all the good options with explanations for them! Now if only we could get that Intimidate Incineroar...
  6. Pyritie

    Pyritie Member

    Jan 27, 2017
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    Thanks for the replies, I originally wrote this back in january on smogon's forums so it was a bit out of date. I've updated it.
  7. MissingNoL

    MissingNoL Member

    Jan 27, 2017
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    I wouldn't really consider Poliwrath usable at all. The idea is that you want it to beat Kartana for rain teams but it does a really poor job at even that. I would replace it with Relicanth, who gets a Continetial Crush based off of Head Smash.
    I would also mention Pikachu as a Lightning Rod user that helps Pelipper use Tailwind in preparation for a Wailord sweep.
    The last thing that I can think of is to perhaps go in-depth about Exeggutor's Z-Trick Room to boost Sleep Powder's accuracy.
  8. 1983 Midwesterners

    1983 Midwesterners New Member

    Jan 30, 2017
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    This is great! Super useful for team building. One thing I would add is physically offensive arcanine. It's pretty common now I think.

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